"百年屈辱,3年人祸", those are not something you want one over the other. They are bad historical periods and you don't want any of them to repeat. 新中国 is not equal to 3年人祸, as United States is not equal to its Civil War. You are obviously switching concepts.
Who I am is not important. The important thing is whether the rate of damage caused by "3年人祸" is actually higher than the things you try to compare with (unfortunately it is). Of course "3年人祸", which happened in peaceful years, should not be compared with war period but it is you who ask people to compare them. Let the numbers talk if you want to compare. Do not question other people's intention when try to debate the facts. You brought the subject so you better be able to defend your logic and conclusion.
I don't understand why you force people to choose between "百年屈辱" and "3年人祸". Why can't we choose between "3年人祸" and something happy, such as "三自一包", "改革开放", "小康社会"?
回复神8的评论:
Some people compare Three Years of Disaster to Naking Massacre, and say Communist China kills more people than Naking Massacre. Such a comparing is totally wrong. It was true that many people died during Cultural Revolution and Communist government was responsible for that. Chinese people and Communist Party have all admitted that. Just like every year many people died of gun crime in US. US people and government admit the fact and everybody know that it’s the reasonability of US government to reduce the gun crimes. Saying Communist China kills more people than Nanking massacre, however, is just the same as saying democratic America kills more American than 911 attact. As every year about 10 thousands of American was killed in gun crimes.
The difference between Culture Revelation as well as three years of disaster and Nanking massacre is just the same as between US gun crimes and 911. One is due to social instability and bad government policies, and other is due to foreign invasion. During Culture Revolution, the death rate is much higher for government officials and CCP officials than the rate in other group. Saying communist China kills more people than Nanking massacre is just the same as saying Democratic America is killing more America than 911. During three years of disaster, many poor Chinese died of hunger, Chinese people know that, and Chinese government know that, and they all know something is not correct, just like US people know that so many gun crimes in US is not correct. There are more poor people died in three years of disaster than government officials is just like there are more poor people fall as gun crimes victims in US. There must be some communists died during three years of disasters, and many who died have relatives as communists. As we know, during civil war in China, it was the most poor who joint the Communist Party. 1959 was only 10 year after civil war and majority of Chinese population was still in countryside. At that time, most of government and party officials were come from the countryside and come from poor families. If there are someone who wants to killed Chinese people intentionally during 1959-1961 and Cultural Revolution, then it should be United States and Soviet Union. They succeed in putting economic sanction on China, which led to humanitarian disasters indirectly.
Communist China is bad. Chinese know it. But Chinese are not foolish enough to overthrow it, as they know that the present China is still the best among all other forms of governments they tried since Opium War. Since Opium War, Chinese tried democracy under Sun Yet-sent but all the Western countries, including democratic ones, just support local war lords in China to extent their state interest at the expense of Chinese democracy and at the expense of Chinese people. That’s why Dr. Sun turned to Soviet and welcomed Communist in China.
In the last a few decades, poverty population reduced all over the world, and China made the number one contribution in reducing world poverty. Many poor peasants of yesterday are rich entrepreneurs today in China, thanks to market economy adapted by Communist China. Regardless the label put on China as communist or capitalist, the present Chinese government works for the better of China and the world.
回复longtermInvestor的评论:
"Caused" is defferent from "killing". US gorvernment cannot eliminate gun crime just as China gorvernment cannot control themselves in the Cultual Reverlution. You are using more suitable word "Caused" than the other who use "killed". "kill" implies intention. US gorvernment intented to reduse gun crime but gun crimes still continured. China government intended to get rid of proverty ?Chinese people but at some years got the opposite result. And it is ture that gun crime kills more US citizents than 911 attack.
longtermInvestor 发表评论于
回复唵啊吽的评论:
gun crimes is not caused by US gov, culture revolution is caused/directed by Chinese gov, you are not comparing the same stuff.
It is true, communist party caused more harm than Nanking massacre. For Nanking massacre, we know it is enemies who are responsible, for culture revolution, Chinese people got confused, not only do we suffer the pain, but also we are lost completely, no one to trust, motherland, comrades, friends, relatives, who can we trust, as a nation, we are still struggling.
唵啊吽 发表评论于
回复满儿的评论:
我外祖父母是在沦陷区日本统治下饿死的。
Some people compare Three Years of Disaster to Naking Massacre, and say Communist China kills more people than Naking Massacre. Such a comparing is totally wrong. It was true that many people died during Cultural Revolution and Communist government was responsible for that. Chinese people and Communist Party have all admitted that. Just like every year many people died of gun crime in US. US people and government admit the fact and everybody know that it’s the reasonability of US government to reduce the gun crimes. Saying Communist China kills more people than Nanking massacre, however, is just the same as saying democratic America kills more American than 911 attact. As every year about 10 thousands of American was killed in gun crimes.
The difference between Culture Revelation as well as three years of disaster and Nanking massacre is just the same as between US gun crimes and 911. One is due to social instability and bad government policies, and other is due to foreign invasion. During Culture Revolution, the death rate is much higher for government officials and CCP officials than the rate in other group. Saying communist China kills more people than Nanking massacre is just the same as saying Democratic America is killing more America than 911. During three years of disaster, many poor Chinese died of hunger, Chinese people know that, and Chinese government know that, and they all know something is not correct, just like US people know that so many gun crimes in US is not correct. There are more poor people died in three years of disaster than government officials is just like there are more poor people fall as gun crimes victims in US. There must be some communists died during three years of disasters, and many who died have relatives as communists. As we know, during civil war in China, it was the most poor who joint the Communist Party. 1959 was only 10 year after civil war and majority of Chinese population was still in countryside. At that time, most of government and party officials were come from the countryside and come from poor families. If there are someone who wants to killed Chinese people intentionally during 1959-1961 and Cultural Revolution, then it should be United States and Soviet Union. They succeed in putting economic sanction on China, which led to humanitarian disasters indirectly.
Communist China is bad. Chinese know it. But Chinese are not foolish enough to overthrow it, as they know that the present China is still the best among all other forms of governments they tried since Opium War. Since Opium War, Chinese tried democracy under Sun Yet-sent but all the Western countries, including democratic ones, just support local war lords in China to extent their state interest at the expense of Chinese democracy and at the expense of Chinese people. That’s why Dr. Sun turned to Soviet and welcomed Communist in China.
In the last a few decades, poverty population reduced all over the world, and China made the number one contribution in reducing world poverty. Many poor peasants of yesterday are rich entrepreneurs today in China, thanks to market economy adapted by Communist China. Regardless the label put on China as communist or capitalist, the present Chinese government works for the better of China and the world.
唵啊吽 发表评论于
回复slow_quick的评论:
Some people compare Three Years of Disaster to Naking Massacre, and say Communist China kills more people than Naking Massacre. Such a comparing is totally wrong. It was true that many people died during Cultural Revolution and Communist government was responsible for that. Chinese people and Communist Party have all admitted that. Just like every year many people died of gun crime in US. US people and government admit the fact and everybody know that it’s the reasonability of US government to reduce the gun crimes. Saying Communist China kills more people than Nanking massacre, however, is just the same as saying democratic America kills more American than 911 attact. As every year about 10 thousands of American was killed in gun crimes.
The difference between Culture Revelation as well as three years of disaster and Nanking massacre is just the same as between US gun crimes and 911. One is due to social instability and bad government policies, and other is due to foreign invasion. During Culture Revolution, the death rate is much higher for government officials and CCP officials than the rate in other group. Saying communist China kills more people than Nanking massacre is just the same as saying Democratic America is killing more America than 911. During three years of disaster, many poor Chinese died of hunger, Chinese people know that, and Chinese government know that, and they all know something is not correct, just like US people know that so many gun crimes in US is not correct. There are more poor people died in three years of disaster than government officials is just like there are more poor people fall as gun crimes victims in US. There must be some communists died during three years of disasters, and many who died have relatives as communists. As we know, during civil war in China, it was the most poor who joint the Communist Party. 1959 was only 10 year after civil war and majority of Chinese population was still in countryside. At that time, most of government and party officials were come from the countryside and come from poor families. If there are someone who wants to killed Chinese people intentionally during 1959-1961 and Cultural Revolution, then it should be United States and Soviet Union. They succeed in putting economic sanction on China, which led to humanitarian disasters indirectly.
Communist China is bad. Chinese know it. But Chinese are not foolish enough to overthrow it, as they know that the present China is still the best among all other forms of governments they tried since Opium War. Since Opium War, Chinese tried democracy under Sun Yet-sent but all the Western countries, including democratic ones, just support local war lords in China to extent their state interest at the expense of Chinese democracy and at the expense of Chinese people. That’s why Dr. Sun turned to Soviet and welcomed Communist in China.
In the last a few decades, poverty population reduced all over the world, and China made the number one contribution in reducing world poverty. Many poor peasants of yesterday are rich entrepreneurs today in China, thanks to market economy adapted by Communist China. Regardless the label put on China as communist or capitalist, the present Chinese government works for the better of China and the world.
回复bluespruce的评论:
Some people compare Three Years of Disaster to Naking Massacre, and say Communist China kills more people than Naking Massacre. Such a comparing is totally wrong. It was true that many people died during Cultural Revolution and Communist government was responsible for that. Chinese people and Communist Party have all admitted that. Just like every year many people died of gun crime in US. US people and government admit the fact and everybody know that it’s the reasonability of US government to reduce the gun crimes. Saying Communist China kills more people than Nanking massacre, however, is just the same as saying democratic America kills more American than 911 attact. As every year about 10 thousands of American was killed in gun crimes.
The difference between Culture Revelation as well as three years of disaster and Nanking massacre is just the same as between US gun crimes and 911. One is due to social instability and bad government policies, and other is due to foreign invasion. During Culture Revolution, the death rate is much higher for government officials and CCP officials than the rate in other group. Saying communist China kills more people than Nanking massacre is just the same as saying Democratic America is killing more America than 911. During three years of disaster, many poor Chinese died of hunger, Chinese people know that, and Chinese government know that, and they all know something is not correct, just like US people know that so many gun crimes in US is not correct. There are more poor people died in three years of disaster than government officials is just like there are more poor people fall as gun crimes victims in US. There must be some communists died during three years of disasters, and many who died have relatives as communists. As we know, during civil war in China, it was the most poor who joint the Communist Party. 1959 was only 10 year after civil war and majority of Chinese population was still in countryside. At that time, most of government and party officials were come from the countryside and come from poor families. If there are someone who wants to killed Chinese people intentionally during 1959-1961 and Cultural Revolution, then it should be United States and Soviet Union. They succeed in putting economic sanction on China, which led to humanitarian disasters indirectly.
Communist China is bad. Chinese know it. But Chinese are not foolish enough to overthrow it, as they know that the present China is still the best among all other forms of governments they tried since Opium War. Since Opium War, Chinese tried democracy under Sun Yet-sent but all the Western countries, including democratic ones, just support local war lords in China to extent their state interest at the expense of Chinese democracy and at the expense of Chinese people. That’s why Dr. Sun turned to Soviet and welcomed Communist in China.
In the last a few decades, poverty population reduced all over the world, and China made the number one contribution in reducing world poverty. Many poor peasants of yesterday are rich entrepreneurs today in China, thanks to market economy adapted by Communist China. Regardless the label put on China as communist or capitalist, the present Chinese government works for the better of China and the world.
bluespruce 发表评论于
版主如不是大陆政府的枪手的话，那真得是属于被党洗脑洗得最彻底的那类人了。共产党最杰出的地方是给人洗脑。那叫一个绝。你去过中国农村吗？！ 知道那里的人是多么可怜吗？知道文革死了多少人吗？人的生命和尊严在党的眼里算什么呀！你在这里比较59－62的饿死人和鸦片战争死去的人的意义是WHAT？ 叫大家别恨这个 人为地饿人的政府？ IT IS STUPID 在这比那个最多。又不是要上吉斯尼记录，62年死的人就算比鸦片战争死去的人少是说明共产党好？？？ 你在哪呢？就冲你叫现在的中国是新中国已足以看那出你要么是可悲的脑痴，要么是昧了良心的枪手。 恶心！！
唵啊吽 发表评论于
回复F-U的评论:
Some people compare Three Years of Disaster to Naking Massacre, and say Communist China kills more people than Naking Massacre. Such a comparing is totally wrong. It was true that many people died during Cultural Revolution and Communist government was responsible for that. Chinese people and Communist Party have all admitted that. Just like every year many people died of gun crime in US. US people and government admit the fact and everybody know that it’s the reasonability of US government to reduce the gun crimes. Saying Communist China kills more people than Nanking massacre, however, is just the same as saying democratic America kills more American than 911 attact. As every year about 10 thousands of American was killed in gun crimes.
The difference between Culture Revelation as well as three years of disaster and Nanking massacre is just the same as between US gun crimes and 911. One is due to social instability and bad government policies, and other is due to foreign invasion. During Culture Revolution, the death rate is much higher for government officials and CCP officials than the rate in other group. Saying communist China kills more people than Nanking massacre is just the same as saying Democratic America is killing more America than 911. During three years of disaster, many poor Chinese died of hunger, Chinese people know that, and Chinese government know that, and they all know something is not correct, just like US people know that so many gun crimes in US is not correct. There are more poor people died in three years of disaster than government officials is just like there are more poor people fall as gun crimes victims in US. There must be some communists died during three years of disasters, and many who died have relatives as communists. As we know, during civil war in China, it was the most poor who joint the Communist Party. 1959 was only 10 year after civil war and majority of Chinese population was still in countryside. At that time, most of government and party officials were come from the countryside and come from poor families. If there are someone who wants to killed Chinese people intentionally during 1959-1961 and Cultural Revolution, then it should be United States and Soviet Union. They succeed in putting economic sanction on China, which led to humanitarian disasters indirectly.
Communist China is bad. Chinese know it. But Chinese are not foolish enough to overthrow it, as they know that the present China is still the best among all other forms of governments they tried since Opium War. Since Opium War, Chinese tried democracy under Sun Yet-sent but all the Western countries, including democratic ones, just support local war lords in China to extent their state interest at the expense of Chinese democracy and at the expense of Chinese people. That’s why Dr. Sun turned to Soviet and welcomed Communist in China.
In the last a few decades, poverty population reduced all over the world, and China made the number one contribution in reducing world poverty. Many poor peasants of yesterday are rich entrepreneurs today in China, thanks to market economy adapted by Communist China. Regardless the label put on China as communist or capitalist, the present Chinese government works for the better of China and the world.
回复唵啊吽的评论:
Do you have numbers for the (abnormal) death during the cultural revolution (1966-1976), can you compare the number to the numbers during 1958-1961? You will find that 1958-1961 is much worse than 1966-1976.
Some people compare Three Years of Disaster to Naking Massacre, and say Communist China kills more people than Naking Massacre. Such a comparing is totally wrong. It was true that many people died during Cultural Revolution and Communist government was responsible for that. Chinese people and Communist Party have all admitted that. Just like every year many people died of gun crime in US. US people and government admit the fact and everybody know that it’s the reasonability of US government to reduce the gun crimes. Saying Communist China kills more people than Nanking massacre, however, is just the same as saying democratic America kills more American than 911 attract. As every year about 10 thousands of American was killed in gun crimes.
The difference between Culture Revelation as well as three years of disaster and Nanking massacre is just the same as between US gun crimes and 911. One is due to social instability and bad government policies, and other is due to foreign invasion. During Culture Revolution, the death rate is much higher for government officials and CCP officials than the rate in other group. Saying communist China kills more people than Nanking massacre is just the same as saying Democratic America is killing more America than 911. During three years of disaster, many poor Chinese died of hunger, Chinese people know that, and Chinese government know that, and they all know something is not correct, just like US people know that so many gun crimes in US is not correct. There are more poor people died in three years of disaster than government officials is just like there are more poor people fall as gun crimes victims in US. There must be some communists died during three years of disasters, and many who died have relatives as communists. As we know, during civil war in China, it was the most poor who joint the Communist Party. 1959 was only 10 year after civil war and majority of Chinese population was still in countryside. At that time, most of government and party officials were come from the countryside and come from poor families. If there are someone who wants to killed Chinese people intentionally during 1959-1961 and Cultural Revolution, then it should be United States and Soviet Union. They succeed in putting economic sanction on China, which led to humanitarian disasters indirectly.
Communist China is bad. Chinese know it. But Chinese are not foolish enough to overthrow it, as they know that the present China is still the best among all other forms of governments they tried since Opium War. Since Opium War, Chinese tried democracy under Sun Yet-sent but all the Western countries, including democratic ones, just support local war lords in China to extent their state interest at the expense of Chinese democracy and at the expense of Chinese people. That’s why Dr. Sun turned to Soviet and welcomed Communist in China.
In the last a few decades, poverty population reduced all over the world, and China made the number one contribution in reducing world poverty. Many poor peasants of yesterday are rich entrepreneurs today in China, thanks to market economy adapted by Communist China. Regardless the label put on China as communist or capitalist, the present Chinese government works for the better of China and the world.
吐谷浑 发表评论于
你真他M的还在睁眼说瞎话！所有的天气水文记录都表明59年～62年是风调雨顺的三年，你他M的到今天还在像纳粹戈贝尔一样，“三年灾害”，“三年灾害”地不停地重复这个谎言，真以为重复到第一万零一遍就真的成真理了！
Go to hell!
slow_quick 发表评论于
回复唵啊吽的评论:
Did 中国人民自己主导 1958-1961 ? Why you try so hard to smooth 1959-1962 out by quoting 1949-1979 ? In China's history, 1958-1961 should always be singled out, and should never be forgotten. Are you trying to challenge the numbers (20-40 million death from famine, without a major war, natural disaster or disease)? In which 3 years before 1949 do we have more people died from famine, without major war, natural disaster or disease)?
You may cheer China's achievement before and after that 3 year period but covering up that 3 years will only weaken your overall score. People who experienced the period are still alive and they are also on this web (WenxuCity, 润涛阎).
Why you only say "from 1949 to 1963". You should do "1959 to 1962" instead. 1959-1962 is one of the worst periods in Chinese history, if not THE worst. Most agrees that between 20 and 40 million people died abnormally in that 3 year period. This is not from natural disasters or wars. Anyone who thinks this is OK has no heart.
