起诉申诉哈佛歧视之后 其他亚裔非亚裔组织的反响

(有许多资料,不断整理中. 这是初稿 Ver 1. 会在博格里更新)

起诉申诉经过简述:
 1. 2014年: Edward Blum的组织Project on Fair Representation, 起诉 哈佛, UNC 歧视亚裔
 2. 2015年5月: 有64 个组织组成的亚裔联盟向司法部和教育部的民权办公室提交了申诉, 指责哈佛歧视  (中文媒体和子坛讨论, 常把这个误称为"起诉", 其实是两回事)

1. 亚裔联盟行动之后. 最先发声的是亚裔 135个民权组织. 他们发表了一封联合公开信(附在后面),
反对亚裔联盟的立场.  除了重申支持 affirmative action 外, 还支持哈佛的Holistic admission. 下面的意见说出来他们的主要关心:
“Instead of asking Americans to come together to help address serious problems in our education system, these folks (注: 指亚裔联盟) are trying to divide communities. We are in this boat together and Asians won’t save our children’s future by pushing other communities overboard,” said Christopher Punongbayan, Executive Director at Advancing Justice – Asian Law Caucus.

2.  代表黑人墨裔等少数民族的组织 The Lawyers’ Committee for Civil Rights Under Law, 对Ed Blum的右翼组织有很高的警惕性. 正在设法加入 Edward Blum 案, filed "motion to intervene". 他们声称, Ed Blum的起诉案的主要对象其实是这些少数民族, 如果起诉成功的话 ' the consequences for blacks, Hispanics and Native Americans would be “catastrophic,” '  这个强烈反应, 正应了上面" pushing other communities overboard"
至于白人的份额, 读了'纯白'痛骂哈佛歧视: 'European Americans, who are about 68%"后即知他们的份额大幅缩水. 加上这次Ed Blum的诉讼不是针对他们, 右翼部分支持Blum. 也有不少对亚裔不利的言论.

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亚裔重视教育, 努力为下一代争取教育资源, 这无可非议.
问题是在追求哈佛之类的稀有资源 扩大自己利益的过程中,  会动了谁的起司.
哈佛的名额, 被多方追逐. Blum和亚裔联盟的举动会促使其他族裔的大反弹.  为了避免Affirmative Action 没顶, 遭遇"catastrophy", 他们一定会联手, 奋力一搏.
稀有资源的争取成功与否, 不是亚裔一厢情愿的事情.

这次Ed Blum 的起诉, 其契机是由他主导的Fisher vs. Texas之案在高院遭遇失败, 高院再次肯定 Affirmative Action. 这促使他重新找一个案例, 继续挑战 AA. 
亚裔的哈佛入取份额, 成了他手中的新长矛. 
只是, 此大战刚出师, 黑人墨裔已经闻风而动, 很快地布局了.
哈佛经过多年多次应战, 也胸有成竹.  其次, 哈佛的 Holistic Admission是当年最高院作为入学标准的范例--种族不是入取的主因, 但为了达到校园有多元化而被容许考虑的一个因素.
 
这次亚裔的申诉,  与1988年 教育部民权办公室受理的案例性质类似:
--主要理由是亚裔进哈佛需有着比其他族裔高的 SAT;
--新的理由是: 亚裔份额比例没有比1992年高. 尽管人口比例增长了. 里面一定有猫腻, 有非法 quota

初步解读:
--SAT一说,  上一次的申诉报告民权办公室已经让哈佛过关. 白人除去运动员和有legacy, 亚裔并没有高于白人. 这一次依旧难以有影响, 尤其是自从那时, 白人的比例比那时下降了近10个百分点.
--亚裔份额一直不变之说并不客观, 这取决于你选90年代哪一年的数字来比.
90年代哈佛亚裔录取从15%到 20.3% 都有. 平均约17%. 亚裔联盟跟着Ron Unz,  挑一那十年里极大值来和这几年20%的比例来比较, 不具说服力.
要用事实上不断浮动但总体上升的比例,  去证明有固定quota, 很难圆其词.

另外, quota一说, 88年申诉时也提出. 90年结案时,  民权办公室的调查没有发现哈佛违法.
这次被Blum重提, 就像加州州大教授 Jennifer Lee所说:

But critics — many within the Asian-American community — have questioned the real motive behind these cases, charging that both may be using the alleged racial discrimination against Asian-Americans as a wedge issue to promote a much larger agenda: the dismantling of affirmative action.

They are trying to confuse people,” University of California Irvine sociologist Jennifer Lee said of the language used in the Harvard complaint. “They don’t discuss affirmative action, but are very deliberate about using the term ‘quotas,’ because it tends to provoke controversy among Americans.”



4. 这次亚裔联盟重复过去的申诉(其实2006年, 2010年分别还有过两次. 后来上诉人撤案),  至今官方的反应有: two U.S. Civil Rights Commissioners on the US Commission on Civil Rights who are Asian American — Michael Yaki and Karen Narasaki — issued their own statement for  a formal civil rights complaint against Harvard:

STATEMENT OF COMMISSIONERS YAKI AND NARASAKI

While we have not reviewed the actual complaint against Harvard University, we hope that this is a sincerely raised issue and not a back door attack on affirmative action that attempts to pit Asian Americans against other minorities, as other efforts have been. Like a majority of Asian Americans, we stand together as long-time supporters of affirmative action. Affirmative action creates opportunities for students disadvantaged by race and circumstances, and a diverse student body ensures that the next generation of Americans is exposed to the variety of life experiences and backgrounds that will help them to build vibrant communities and successfully work in the global economy.

Neither of us believes that any racial or ethnic group should be subjected to quotas. Nor do we believe that test scores alone entitle anyone to admission at Harvard. Students are more than their test scores and grades. Well-constructed and properly implemented admissions programs further our principles of equal opportunity. While we understand that some programs may be imperfect, or even need substantial reform, we do not support any attempt to eliminate affirmative action programs at Harvard or any institution of higher learning.

We will closely review the complaint and the University’s response and closely monitor developments in this situation.
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The U.S. Commission on Civil Rights  has previously found  the argument that racial disparities in admissions are de facto evidence of discriminatory quotas to be unpersuasive.
No new evidence has thus far been presented by anti-affirmative action lobbyists since those findings

 




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135组织的公开信:

As individuals and more than 135 organizations across the United States that serve and represent Asian American, Native Hawaiian and Pacific Islander (AANHPI) communities, we believe that equal opportunity is a cherished principle in American society that must be protected. Our universities should reflect our diverse democracy and expand opportunities for those students who have overcome significant barriers. Rather than letting ourselves be divided, we must come together to ensure increased opportunities and success for all students.

 

Affirmative action does not constitute quotas

Unfortunately, there have been attempts by some to engage in divisive wedge politics by using misguided, misleading tactics to attack equal opportunity by calling for an end to race sensitive admissions policies at educational institutions such as Harvard University and University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill. Opponents of affirmative action have wrongfully and disingenuously equated affirmative action with quotas.

The truth is that affirmative action does not constitute quotas.

Affirmative action does not exclude or limit the admission of students from any specific racial or ethnic background. Indeed, the United States Supreme Court long ago prohibited quotas in the higher education admissions process, including banning limits on the admission or enrollment of any racial or ethnic group.

To be clear, we oppose quotas, discrimination, and bias against any racial or ethnic group.

 

Affirmative action promotes equal opportunity for all

We support affirmative action which, as noted above, does not constitute quotas, discrimination, or bias against Asian Americans.

Currently, affirmative action at universities consists of race sensitive holistic admissions policies. These policies promote equal opportunity in a society where racism still exists and racial barriers continue to unfairly limit educational opportunities for students of color. For example, our schools are more segregated today than they were in the late 1960s. Students of color, particularly African Americans, Latinos, Native Americans, Pacific Islanders, and Southeast Asians, are much more likely to attend under-resourced K-12 schools. Implicit bias and stereotyping also further impact and harm the educational learning environments and opportunities of students of color. Universities should consider these factors when reviewing applications for admissions.

All students benefit from the racially and ethnically diverse learning environments fostered by race sensitive holistic admissions processes, including the benefits of increased cross-racial understanding, reduction of stereotyping and isolation of minority students, and training for a diverse workforce and society.

 

Affirmative action simply takes into account whether an applicant has overcome significant obstacles and institutional barriers, such as racial and ethnic discrimination

Affirmative action simply takes into account whether an applicant has overcome racial and ethnic adversity as one of several factors in a holistic review of an applicant’s qualifications, leadership, and potential. Holistic admissions processes also consider, for example, whether an applicant has endured poverty or is the first in her family to attend college.

Moreover, in the context of college admissions, “merit” cannot be quantified by grade point average, SAT scores, or number of activities alone. Instead, life experiences such as overcoming racial and ethnic adversity are critical factors in a student’s leadership and potential contribution to the university and to our society. In addition, numbers, like grade point averages and standardized test scores, are not colorblind and often reflect and magnify K-12 educational inequities.

 

Equal opportunity strengthens our democracy

Affirmative action policies help to level the playing field and promote diverse university learning environments that are essential in our multiracial and multicultural society. Our democracy benefits from a diverse and educated populace and workforce.

Those who are truly committed to equal educational opportunity should demonstrate real leadership and reinvest in higher education throughout the nation to expand access, affordability, equity, and student success. Decades of disinvestment in higher education across the country have made college less accessible for all students, especially students of color. We call for unity in standing up for the future of our youth and realizing the promise of equal opportunity for all in the United States.



明海蓝天 发表评论于
个人之见:哈佛毕竟是私立学校,应当有一定的自由选择,以便谋求生存,赢利和发展。
weston 发表评论于
回复 '乱打乒乓胡下棋' 的评论 : 谢谢赞言! 华人以为哭了就有奶吃,缺乏大局观.没意识到这是在设法抢他人的奶喝. 
乱打乒乓胡下棋 发表评论于
回复 'weston' 的评论 : 这是迄今在紫檀里读到的最为客观最为详实的关于H官司的介绍。不少人以为闹闹总比不闹好,其实很多时候真不是这样。
weston 发表评论于
回复 'Etornado' 的评论 : 谢谢留言. 说的确凿.
Etornado 发表评论于
藤校是培养人类领袖的摇篮。如果去藤校仅是为了找份好工作,去当个医生、律师、会计师,可以拿份稳定不错的薪水,可以让父母长面子,那么藤校就彻底被糟蹋了。
Etornado 发表评论于
更正:你认为你爬上藤校的小亚裔可以将来可以成为西裔社区的领袖?
Etornado 发表评论于
我不同意状告哈佛,因为这是个毫无道理的官司。例如:你上法庭去控告某一机构在雇请员工时种族歧视,法庭的调查方向是申请和雇佣上是否合符种族比例,如果是合符比例,则控告不成立。目前亚裔在美国人口的比例是1%,而亚裔学生在哈佛超过17%。控告哈佛种族歧视的理由至少在招生结果上并不成立。人家哈佛已经讲过了,学习成绩只是挑选的其中一个条件!不是唯一的条件!

哈佛之所以成为哈佛是经过超一百多年的经验和经营的积累。这个成功除了教书育人外,对学生的挑选也是成功的关键之一。如何挑选学生有哈佛自己的一套经验和考虑。如果你认为哈佛挑选的方向不对,那是否你认为你的看法比哈佛好?如果你认为是这样,那你还去哈佛干嘛?自己开办大学就好了呗,是吗?!

不顾你承认与否,美国人在种族上是扎堆的。例如大多数的黑人还是和黑人玩,大多数西裔和西裔玩,大多数亚裔和亚裔玩。哈佛招取某些族裔的优秀学生加以培养,目的是把他们变成领导者。你认为你爬上藤校的小亚裔可以将来可以西裔社区领袖?人家黑人团体会因为你SAT分数高藤校毕业就听你的?开什么玩笑。
武胜 发表评论于
Diversity是不错,但仍有将其作为借口在招生中践行quota之实,以招生过程不透明为之护航。diversity与quota的差别是有多元化但不设立数量标准,“narrowly tailored”-只是微调。但现在这些AA论调强调“underrepresented”是在争取数量标准。
冷眼向洋看世界 发表评论于
回复“weston”: affirmative action 目的就是要不惜降低标准来确保某些族裔入学,quota就是为此而分娩出来的怪胎。现在“法律上”(或名义上)不能有quota,但实际上依然靠降低标准来“多元化”,换汤不换药。
我并不期望改变你的观点,你不愿讨论也是你的自由,悉听尊便。
weston 发表评论于
回复 '冷眼向洋看世界' 的评论 : 法律上有明确界限.你慢慢去研究. 好了, 不再跟你继续着话题了
冷眼向洋看世界 发表评论于
回复“weston”: quota 就是 affirmative action 分娩出来的怪胎。硬说两者之间没有关系,那和掩耳盗铃有什么两样!
weston 发表评论于
回复 '冷眼向洋看世界' 的评论 : 你既然不愿了解这些差别, 已经把这些相关但不同的概念等同起来, 就没什么可说了. 这和老外说中国人和日本人看着一样. 无法理喻.
我先结束这'讨论'.
冷眼向洋看世界 发表评论于
回复“weston”: quota名义上是废了,事实上还在。 affirmative action 目的就是为了quota,不管它换多少名词。
weston 发表评论于
回复 '冷眼向洋看世界' 的评论 : quota早就废了. 不必再三陈述
冷眼向洋看世界 发表评论于
affirmative action 如果真是好东西,为什么事实上只在大学招生中实行?公司董事会和管理阶层为什么不按种族分配quota? 联邦及州议会的议员为什么不按种族分配quota?NBA和各个球队为什么不按种族分配quota?
weston 发表评论于
回复 '武胜' 的评论 : 我太熟悉这些学校了:)
AA是权宜之计. diversity 会长久, 这是美国的优势, 不会放弃的.
武胜 发表评论于
回复Weston: 精英学校里推迟或难于毕业的大概比你想象的要多。


即便在有利AA的判例中,最高法院也给出25年的期限,表明AA只是一种权宜,目标是race-neutral。那种强化或长期化AA的论调是反历史潮流的。正确的做法是让AA逐渐式微。
weston 发表评论于
回复 'XYZ3' 的评论 : Michigan Proposition2 的case并不和 Grutter case矛盾. 高院只是说, 如果选民决定取消AA, 他们无法干涉.
weston 发表评论于
回复 '武胜' 的评论 : 社会需要各种人才. 哈佛的宗旨并不局限于培养好学生,这是中国的概念.
美国高校有各种难易程度的专业, 同一专业里有各种难易程度的课程.
只有被接受的, 都有希望找到合适的专业/课程, 完成学业.
XYZ3 发表评论于
建议大家去Wikipedia上查一下有关AA的几个case。比如下面两个:


Grutter v. Bollinger

Schuette v. Coalition to Defend Affirmative Action


武胜 发表评论于
应当形成一种务实的风气:进入大学,即便是名校,并不值得大惊小怪。以优异成绩从那里毕业才是值得自豪的。
武胜 发表评论于
AA成立的条件本来是种族歧视,但看文中推动AA的理由已经从种族歧视向族群差别移位。这种改变恰恰说明种族歧视现象已经得到改善,AA的成立条件弱化。继续推动AA会形成反向歧视。此外文中把社会经济弱势与种族等价并不客观。扶助弱势与种族不应关联。

其实把大学看成争夺的资源本身就是一个误区,这导致受到照顾入学者最后毕业困难,除非你每门课都给他照顾,但这还象大学么?这个误区也包括那些恶补考题高分低能者,入门后表现不好又有什么用?
helix22 发表评论于
I do believe that the college admissions think highly of the academic performance, except in a racially "sensitive" way. They downplay the importance of academic performance when it suits their agenda. Anyway, the more important is transparency regardless of the "merit" used in the evaluation.
冷眼向洋看世界 发表评论于
同意“岁月静好”的观点。哈佛的quota (以及affirmative action)强调的是结果的公平,而不是程序的公平,造成勤奋的人和懒惰的人在结果上的“平等”,这是非常不公平的。
weston 发表评论于
回复 '岁月静好' 的评论 : Using hard metrics is satisfying, only in a facile way.
It gives the outputs in a clear manner, w/o saying anything about the inputs. Holistic methods aim to see the whole picture.

岁月静好 发表评论于
I re-read the article.

"Moreover, in the context of college admissions, “merit” cannot be quantified by grade point average, SAT scores, or number of activities alone. Instead, life experiences such as overcoming racial and ethnic adversity are critical factors in a student’s leadership and potential contribution to the university and to our society. In addition, numbers, like grade point averages and standardized test scores, are not colorblind and often reflect and magnify K-12 educational inequities."

This is what the leftists always say. Then what is merit? If you ask every college admissions officer, they would tell you that GPA, SAT, AP, etc are how they measure ACADEMIC achievements. Do we really want to go to the route of twisting the facts? We can argue about why there are performance discrepancy, but we cannot deny that there have to be a way to measure academics and there is a way to measure it. I would be more satisfied if they argue that "GPA, SAT and AP" are not indicators whether a student can graduate college or whether a student can be successful in the future. If the colleges really believe those are not merits, why are they publishing all those number to show that they have certain academic standards?
weston 发表评论于
回复 '岁月静好' 的评论 :
现在是严重僧多粥少. 无论如何分这个蛋糕, 都有人或者族裔觉得不fair的.
Did you read, http://blog.wenxuecity.com/myblog/14895/201506/12437.html
See the ratios there.
Besides, as said in the blog, in 1990, 2006 and 2010, we've seen the same complaints and the US Cmmissioners' comments this time show little patience.
岁月静好 发表评论于
Weston "没有民权运动, 哪有亚裔现在在哈佛的份额?"
That is so true. I am not against civil right or AA. I think we should learn from this. If some of us feel we are unfairly treated, we should have the courage to voice our opinions. Instead of being afraid or shy or angering some other groups. In the end, by fighting for equal treatment, we are helping the society to grow.

Again, it is good that there are different opinions on whether we are discriminated or not. In the end, we are over-represented as a group in a lot of ivy+ colleges. The bigger question is: is this good for society? Is it OK to deny some kids' chances to go to Harvard because they are Asian as a group?
weston 发表评论于
回复 '岁月静好' 的评论 : 没有民权运动, 哪有亚裔现在在哈佛的份额?
哈佛怎么也不会像caltech 那样.
1. STEM不是哈佛主题, 最多1/3
2. 女生大减
3. 子坛里, Caltech 不受欢迎.
岁月静好 发表评论于
-"亚裔联盟行动之后. 最先发声的是亚裔 135个民权组织." I wonder who they really represented. Harvard admission process is a "myth". It would be a good thing that the process is more transparent.
-"此大战刚出师, 黑人墨裔已经闻风而动, 很快地布局" Other minority don't feel guilty that Asian is the minority that is disadvantaged. Why are we so shy of asking for fair treatment? For the sake of pleasing others? This is high education we are talking about. Jews are over-represented, but on one seems to be bothered. Look at Cal Tech, there are a lot of Asian students. No one thinks that the university is hurt by the high percentage of Asian students.
随意001 发表评论于
Weston,不要去注意这些细节,没有意义。狠话谁都会说,毕竟是要上法庭。出了法庭,大家只记得曾经有这么个案子。再说了,没有这个案子,那些所谓的少数民族对亚裔的态度就不敌视吗?所以,没有损失。他们爱怎么说怎么说去。
weston 发表评论于
回复 '随意001' 的评论 :
看懂了 "back door attack on affirmative action that attempts to pit Asian Americans against other minorities" 的意思?
mapletea 发表评论于
顶随意001!
随意001 发表评论于
很好啊。有这么大的动静就是好事。许多的事情只要能够提醒当事人注意就已经成功了一大半了。当年卢刚杀人,那个负面吧?结果美国的研究生院对中国人态度好了许多。起诉哈佛的事情,走到这一步,已经赢了,剩下也就是可以捞多少就是多少的问题。现在已经稳赚不赔!干得好啊,同胞们!
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